Selling Out - how much music artists earn online

tone-def · Post by **tone-def** » Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:55 pm

revy wrote:ok maybe that was a stretch. how bout replace the electrotits with cool dude with sunglasses playing "exclusive minimal vinyl"!

but isn't he the guy with the laptop

revy · Post by **revy** » Wed Apr 21, 2010 10:34 pm

haha well maybe. i guess there are cool dudes with sunglasses doing all kinds of things in this crazy world

Themis · Post by **Themis** » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:05 pm

patrick bateman wrote:But what was the point again regarding this competition thing? haha

yeah its all well-thought-out

the discussion runs normaly this way

Vinyl DJ says: Digital sucks, no skill needed, you are no DJs
Digital DJ says: haha what skill beatmatching? what really counts is only the output, what comes out of the speakers in the end. Digital offers so many possibilites and so much creativity

also we have established that many DJs think they are artists who create artworks with there music. (Which would be a own topic for a discussion)

Now what you could deduce from the digital DJ statement is that skill is not a requirement, cause they are all artists and it doesnt matter what tools a artist use if the artwork is good.

so now we got to the point were we agreed that skill is needed cause there is a competition between DJs.

and i hope i dont get this "only what comes out of the speakers is what counts" kind of argument in the next discussion. cause its really some lame lame excuse. and if you ask a guy who brings that argument why exactly he is the one behind the booth, he doesn't really have an answer..

Maybe he thinks his artwork is greater as the artwork of some other guy, which would be hilarious - to be an artist and then enter mental a competition and rate some other DJ work as better or worse.

patrick bateman · Post by **patrick bateman** » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:26 pm

But digital dj's also need skills, they still need the selection skill, they still need the 'reading the crowd' skill.

Furthermore, many 'digital' dj's still use vinyl/cd control, so they also have to beatmatch.

So sorry, I can't follow you thought out theory at all.

Of course, I understand what you say, in regards to what I and others have said often, that it's the output that counts. Because what if the DJ just puts on a mixed CD, and nothing else. Would that be okay for us, well we should answer yes if we were true to the 'only the output counts' statement, but I guess none of us would say that this would be okay.

It's all a grey area and not only black & white which I think is often used in these discussions, I hope you can see that too.

To repeat myself again, vinyl DJ's can play good sets, same with Digital dj's, and they can both play super bad sets too.

Off to bed here

Themis · Post by **Themis** » Wed Apr 21, 2010 11:41 pm

yes great that we finally have a consens here.. so we both think that it's not just the output what counts..

and of course digital deejaying needs skills too.. in an other discussion we could list which skills these are..

but in former discussions digital deejays didn't want to get in competition.. they didn't want to compare skills.. they were like "i'm doing my thing, it'
s my art, my personal expression and it has nothing to do with what the other guys do" ..

now we can compare what digital deejays do and what vinyl deejays do.. and the next time someone says it needs no skills to play with a laptop etc.. you can clearly point out what skills are needed..

and hopefully we see no more avoiding of the comparison between the skills of deejays..

ps: mainly my point aims at guys like dubfire, speedy j ,liebing etc.. the way u use traktor is not far away from playing with vinyl..

good night

Opuswerk · Post by **Opuswerk** » Thu Apr 22, 2010 8:34 am

great to see it got to a consensus while i was away

.
It's definitely well pointed that it's not "only" what comes out of the speakers that counts. However this is the main output. I'm not sure "just" playing a recorded mix would really work well at a party because it would completely lack "crowd reading" skills, and "working with what the warm-up dj played before" skill.
Maybe it's far stretched, but if this competition thing is pushed further maybe one could list the skills needed as in ice skating, or gymnastics. I'd be very interested to see how much weight beatmatching takes in that discussion, versus things like crowd reading, equing, mixing in, mixing out, track selection and the likes...

@ Themis:
I kind of over-reacted in the previous posts. was having a very bad day...

patrick bateman · Post by **patrick bateman** » Thu Apr 22, 2010 9:00 am

I put up a thread & poll for the skills debate.
http://www.mnml.nl/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=58910

Themis · Post by **Themis** » Thu Apr 22, 2010 9:01 am

wasnt offended by anything you wrote so dont worry