Not to add flames to the fire or anything... but personally I think Steevio is one of the true 'great' musicians of our time, and is more than qualified to make such statements.
Additionally, in my opinion, western music theory is complete bullshit. Not only is the whole notion of using a system of rules and regulations to govern an artform entirely retarded, but the fact that the system is based on an approximation makes it even more ridiculous.
well, that's my 2 cents anyway.
Music Theory
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oblioblioblio
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It's not about rules.
It's about being able to call blue blue, to call yellow yellow... and being able to pull some green of blue and yellow, because you know blue and yellow will give you green.
C minor triad(blue), G minor triad(yellow)... slap 'em on top of each other and they give you green(Cminor9th).
Good things to know. As long as you don't know, you don"t know how good of a thing it is to know.
But fck it. What the fck do I know????!?
It's about being able to call blue blue, to call yellow yellow... and being able to pull some green of blue and yellow, because you know blue and yellow will give you green.
C minor triad(blue), G minor triad(yellow)... slap 'em on top of each other and they give you green(Cminor9th).
Good things to know. As long as you don't know, you don"t know how good of a thing it is to know.
But fck it. What the fck do I know????!?
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oblioblioblio
- mnml maxi
- Posts: 2556
- Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2006 1:38 am
- Contact:
ok, perhaps rules was the wrong word, but I find that a lot of western music theory treats itself like a science, with very little grey area... Either something is 'correct' or 'incorrect', and though there is a lot of science in music (i.e. the physical principles underlying the interaction of waveforms etc etc etc), there is a vast landmass of subjectivity decided only by personal preference, that no principle can cover.
I think most of learning about music is finding out what works for you. If you feel more comfortable applying the theories of others to find out what works for you, and you make sounds that you like, then you're doing the right thing and no one can tell you otherwise. It's always good to remember the other side of the coin though (www.nonoctave.com
)
I think what Steevio was trying to say is that we have an innate and personal 'science' of sound (i.e. which musical interactions appeal to us personally (or even 'pre'-personally)), and the best way to learn music theory is to experiment with these personal resonances.
I hope I haven't come across as arrogant myself, I don't want this to be a closed discussion, as really there are no right or wrong answers, and this is interesting ground to cover.
peace, mark.
I think most of learning about music is finding out what works for you. If you feel more comfortable applying the theories of others to find out what works for you, and you make sounds that you like, then you're doing the right thing and no one can tell you otherwise. It's always good to remember the other side of the coin though (www.nonoctave.com
)I think what Steevio was trying to say is that we have an innate and personal 'science' of sound (i.e. which musical interactions appeal to us personally (or even 'pre'-personally)), and the best way to learn music theory is to experiment with these personal resonances.
I hope I haven't come across as arrogant myself, I don't want this to be a closed discussion, as really there are no right or wrong answers, and this is interesting ground to cover.
peace, mark.
Re: Music Theory
wow i cant believe that me saying you dont need piano lessons to apply non-western scales to minimal techno could provoke such anger in someone.thom wrote:steevio wrote: just get a bunch of scales from the net, and play them on a keyboard, you dont need lessons, and you dont need to be able to play a piano, just use your ears.
when you find a scale you like the sound of, use it in your music. its as simple as that.
i use non-western scales all the time, but i'm a very limited keyboard player.
you will find you have a resonance with certain scales, maybe its from your deep ancestry.Christ!!
Have you studied harmony? I assume you haven't... or not for very long or in depth. No one that did can say something like that. NO ONE.
Don't give such non-advice... jeez. That's just wrong man.
i have studied harmony, infact i make my music entirely using harmonics, its actually at the core of everything i do.
sorry dude,
maybe i should just get back in the studio.
ok its too easy to be misunderstood in these forums,
i wont attempt to defend myself, oblioblioblio has said everything i need to say but much more eloquently and with more tact than i'm capable of.
i suppose i was defending the millions of self-taught musicians that have existed since we first started banging hollow logs with sticks.
i would never say to anyone dont learn music theory, it fascinates me and i'm very focussed on it, but i taught myself and i'm massively indebted to the internet for providing me with instant access to this knowlege, but before that i had to rely on my ears, and for 99.9% of the time i still do.
when i make music i dont rely on the western system, i tune the oscillators on my synths to harmonics, i rarely use the keyboard, unless i'm using it as a way of playing in rhythm.
when i first started making techno it felt like i had been freed from the constraints that the various musical instruments i'd learned to play seemed to impose on me due to the physicality of the interface, in other words i could break the rules, and i now had as many pairs of hands as i needed.
but it didnt take me long to realise that underlying everything i did, there was harmonic structure, and so i wanted to know how that worked.
i think if i'd wanted to be a pianist, i would have got myself some piano lessons, but i thought it more important as a techno musician to first learn the language of the machines i was using, and use my intuition to make music.
in hindsight i wish i'd investigated music theory earlier, as now its become an obsession for me, but the cool thing is we never stop learning, and i'm a true believer in the Flow, and that everthing is exactly as its supposed to be.
damn looks like i went and tried to defend myself anyway.
easy guys.
i wont attempt to defend myself, oblioblioblio has said everything i need to say but much more eloquently and with more tact than i'm capable of.
i suppose i was defending the millions of self-taught musicians that have existed since we first started banging hollow logs with sticks.
i would never say to anyone dont learn music theory, it fascinates me and i'm very focussed on it, but i taught myself and i'm massively indebted to the internet for providing me with instant access to this knowlege, but before that i had to rely on my ears, and for 99.9% of the time i still do.
when i make music i dont rely on the western system, i tune the oscillators on my synths to harmonics, i rarely use the keyboard, unless i'm using it as a way of playing in rhythm.
when i first started making techno it felt like i had been freed from the constraints that the various musical instruments i'd learned to play seemed to impose on me due to the physicality of the interface, in other words i could break the rules, and i now had as many pairs of hands as i needed.
but it didnt take me long to realise that underlying everything i did, there was harmonic structure, and so i wanted to know how that worked.
i think if i'd wanted to be a pianist, i would have got myself some piano lessons, but i thought it more important as a techno musician to first learn the language of the machines i was using, and use my intuition to make music.
in hindsight i wish i'd investigated music theory earlier, as now its become an obsession for me, but the cool thing is we never stop learning, and i'm a true believer in the Flow, and that everthing is exactly as its supposed to be.
damn looks like i went and tried to defend myself anyway.
easy guys.
